My Fiancé’s Secular University Experience

Almost a year ago, my wonderful fiancé (boyfriend at the time) wrote a guest post for me about his journey away from religion through his life. Here, he has further expanded on how the lack of religion has impacted his experience at his secular university.

Warning: What you are about to read is an account of my experience at a secular university, which some may find very disturbing.

After graduating in May, I feel I can finally talk about this. You have no idea what it is like to wake up in your dorm room and be afraid of dying every single day, or to have to add a daily routine of preparing myself for whatever horror I may experience that day.

Heading off to class was far from easy. I was constantly afraid of getting mugged, or even worse, killed. Some days I would have to take the long way to class just to avoid certain groups of barbaric nonbelievers that would mean certain death. I would finally arrive at class and sit down, but never in the back. That’s where all the druggies and whores sat. As everyone shuffled into class minutes late and the professor struggled to get everyone settled down, I would look around and each day it seemed like fewer and fewer people came. Some just went missing, and others died, maybe from drugs or even murdered in cold-blood.

The days I mustered up enough curiosity to glance to the back of the room, with the fear of accidentally gaining eye contact, it was a horrendous sight. There were men sitting there with blank stares on their face from whatever drugs they were on that day and women in ripped and tattered promiscuous clothing. The mascara running down their faces told me that they probably cried for hours after being brutally abused and/or raped by the nonbelievers with no morals.

The professor would eventually start lecturing over the subtle cries from the back of the room and the gunshots from outside. Topics ranging from how the bible is just a lie and every Christian was lying to themselves. Many classes would even go as far as to brain wash us to believe in the big bang theory and even worse… evolution.

Eventually, I would have to eat at the dining hall. I cannot express how disheartening it is to walk in to the dining room and see no one praying before they eat. But the food was even worse: most days there was just slop but on rare occasions we would be treated to a sacrificed virgin or fresh baby.

As I laid down to sleep every night I had existential thoughts: If there is no god, what is my purpose in life? Why don’t I just die without god in my everyday life? As I spiraled further and further down this black hole I was suddenly hit with the realization that I could have picked a Christian college to attend. With this thought in my head, I would cry myself to sleep.

I am sorry to inform you, but none of this account is true. The Closet Atheist’s apologetics teacher, however, believes exactly this. According to my fiancee, this is how he views my alma mater, which is right down the road from hers. He thinks it is a secular university full of atheists that have no morals and resist authority at all cost, and professors that teach anti-Christian topics and speak out against god. I will tell you that none of this is true; in fact, it’s quite the opposite. Now my school is nowhere near as Christian as The Closet Atheist’s school, but one study says that almost two thirds of its students are religious.

Once in a required public speaking course, everyone in the class took a short survey so that we can see our demographics, and one question was our religious affiliation. When we went over our responses, I was surprised. Out of around 30 students, only two (one being me) were not religious while the majority were Christian, and most of the Christians were Catholic. This does align with the overall statistic that 59.8% of my school is religious and 30.1% of that is Catholic. I do not know how many of them are practicing their religions, though. I would seldom see people praying before they eat.

The bashing of god or religion in or out of the classroom just did not happen, as my fiancee’s teacher so loved to claim. The closest that a professor came to that was in a lecture about ethics where we were taught a list of ethical frameworks/theories and one was the divine command theory, which falls under deontology. My professor, who I knew wasn’t religious, kind of scoffed at this ethical theory. A summary of this lesson is below:

Deontology – an approach to ethics that judges the morality of an action based on the action’s adherence to a rule or rules. Deontologists look at rules and duties.

Divine Command Theory – based on the idea that good actions are those aligned with the will of God and bad actions are those contrary to the will of God. Divine Command Theory is largely based on the rule of law as outlined in the Bible, the Torah, and the Qur’an. (My teacher gave the example of the Ten Commandments as outlined in Leviticus 19:3-18.)

The case FOR the Divine Command Theory:

  • We owe obedience to our Creator
  • God is all-good and all-knowing
  • God is the ultimate authority

The case AGAINST the Divine Command Theory:

  • There are many holy books, and some of their teachings disagree with each other.
  • It is unrealistic to assume a multicultural society will adopt a religion-based morality
  • Some moral problems are not addressed directly in scripture.
  • It is fallacious to equate “the good” with “God”.
  • The divine command theory is based on obedience, not reason.

I believe it is worth noting that when taught these ethical frameworks/theories my professor did stay unbiased towards all of them, even though I knew from personal conversations that he was not religious. The only other time I ever talked about religion in a class was in a liberal arts class called Human Diversity in which we had a chapter about the religions of the world. Here we simply talked about the different major religions and their statistics, and we touched on intelligent design.

Outside of the classroom, we would sometimes have a Christian radical that would stand outside talking about god, and I can remember one time when he started yelling that god hates gays, and there was some negative response from the student body, most of whom openly accept homosexuality.

Of course, unlike The Closet Atheist’s apologetics teacher seems to think, at my secular college, students don’t steal from or rape other people every day out in public any more than they would at any other school. My university also had many on-campus religious organizations that held meetings, raised money for charities, advertised on campus, and had a large following similar to the many other organizations on campus.

Overall, the point to this post is to disprove, from a first hand account, that my university is not the terrible and outrageous ways The Closet Atheist’s apologetics professor believes and has the audacity to put in the minds of his students.

36 Replies to “My Fiancé’s Secular University Experience”

  1. I can relate strongly to this blog post, having gone for 2 years to a church-based university and then transferring to my hometown ‘secular’ university. So much that I read about ‘secular’ schools basically matches your description and I laugh. My mother still seems to think that the mean atheist professor who insists that god is dead (basically the plot of God’s Not Dead) is a real thing (though she didn’t go to a university so she doesn’t have first hand experience with that.) Even though I learned things in university that caused me to question religious teachings, I never had a professor push atheism.

    But I think that’s the point of your apologetics teacher. He can’t say that he’s afraid you’ll learn things that will challenge your belief and cast doubt on his teachings. Nope, must be those mean atheist professors and heathen students!


  2. Honestly, from the way you describe your apologetics teacher, he needs to see mental help. The guy sounds so brainwashed he’s using horrible arguments to attempt to brainwash others to his level of stupid, and wouldn’t last two minutes in a real debate. It’s sad that he’s teaching others to use the same arguments over and over making our lives more difficult, plus the fact he’s teaching in his alternate reality where if you’re not Christian then you’re evil. Despite the fact 90% of America’s prison population is Christian, plus everything that’s been going on in politics regarding religion. (Cough, Roy Moore, Cough.)

    I really hope things get better for you CA, also I enjoyed your fiancé’s writing on the topic. All in all nice post.

    Liked by 2 people

  3. Well written and on topic. I think you’ve done this before.

    Odd how the “Word of God” needs to be written by men on man’s inventions. If “I” were God, I’d probably arrange the stars so that they spelled out words. Or etched canyons in the Moon forming symbols that equated to My Word. Now, which language I picked to Write My Word — that would depend on which group sacrificed the most virgins to me…Ding Ding Ding — we have a winner!

    Liked by 3 people

      1. The Mind of Me, as God, would of course be inscrutable, as I (It) should very well be. How could a mere mortal dare to know the mind of Me, God?
        If “I” expect virgins to be sacrificed (either gender mind you), then if you want those Canyons of the Moon carved in your language — you’d better get busy.

        Liked by 1 person

        1. It’s unfortunate that you have a low veiw of the Ideal. Why shouldn’t a child come to know his Father’s Mind on things? That’s a rough childhood.

          But, enlighten me, what religion or cult are you talking about with regards to the Virgin sacrifices? Or, are you simply striking fear into those who don’t want to waste time to know the mind of You?

          Liked by 1 person

          1. I was being silly.
            But my statement regarding the Word of God (any God) having to be, first interpreted by Man, written by Man, on inventions made by Man, and only within the last 3000 years… is suspect.
            Why cheat out the prior 95,000 years of humans who lived before the current era from knowing the Word of God? Could It not have figured out some means to communicate the extremely simple rules by which all humans should live by? Don’t kill, don’t steal, be kind. How hard would that have been, you know, for a God? And of course the reason is that the Word of God is really the Word of Man (or men) throughout the ages.

            Liked by 3 people

            1. I will admit I don’t know as much as I should about the predictions or implications of taking evolution backwards with a glance of the progressions. But, if I were to speculate, it could be because the humans back nearly a 100,000 years didn’t have some capacity or faculty that we do today. Perhaps they were savages, or, perhaps they lacked the ingrained capacity of ethical behavior. And, even if the glimpsed into the deep beyond, it could very well be that they saw, and yet didn’t understand. They knew what was wrong, and failed to draw a principle. Or, my personal favorite, they had a limited capacity to see truths outside of experience and based in inference.

              All in all, humanity is young. I suppose there’s no need to rush the process.

              Liked by 1 person

            2. Homo Sapiens Sapiens is indeed young. And I’m pretty sure our species has been genetically identical for the last 100k+ years. So, they should have had no trouble receiving My Word.
              And, again, if I were God, and I even bothered to create Man, I probably wouldn’t create them in a way that they couldn’t understand me. Nor would I make my message so darn difficult to comprehend that only a few learned men could deduce and write down my instructions for life. Which, I can whittle down to just two words: Be Kind. I’m pretty sure the Moon could support some kind of symbol like that:

              Liked by 1 person

            3. Alright, I’ll admit that those are good points. I’ll also admit that I don’t believe we’ve been around for 100,000 years, but something around 6,000. I’m sure seems rather absurd to you, which is why I’ve tried to avoid it. But, before you turn away from my garbage, please listen to my rational: mainstream Science rides on the axiom that the world is a closed system. It doesn’t account for what God seems to say about creation because it’s goal is to explain things in terms of mechanism and not of agency. I’m not saying that’s wrong, and that science ought to be damned, but if it comes down to an assumption v.s what I think to be true, I have to drop the assumption, and therefore, I don’t believe in an old Earth.

              Liked by 1 person

  4. I think it’s an example of how even supposedly secular institutions pander to religion that under the case against the divine command theory, the primary argument – that there is no god/creator – is missing.


      1. Christianity lost that moral argument, when they elected a moral monster as president. The falsity of that moral argument is underscored by Christian support for a tax bill which is a 2 trillion dollar heist — stealing from the poor to give to the rich.

        Liked by 2 people

        1. I do not want to be drawn into the argument about the so-called monster president. I have already written a post on that on my blog. Besides, he is a product of democracy, Christian or not.

          Like Him or not, he has the mandate of the people.


  5. The point of being a Christian is not on the basis of simple morality… It is about having a relationship with God through His Son Jesus Christ. One is not a Christian if that understanding is not there, including the ones sighted in your statistics.

    Even if someone rejects the notion that God exists, that doesn’t automatically make such one a ruthless salvage, contrary to the picture painted in the post. That much is clear to me and to most other true believers in God.

    Besides, there are already enough laws in the civilised world to hold people accountable for their behaviours.

    What should bother one is the eternal consequence of a disposition that rejects God. And it would be laughable to suggest that the Creator will have no way of holding His creatures accountable.

    Let me add that the whole notion of God is grossly misunderstood and misrepresented: Misunderstood by those who don’t believe in His existence and sometimes misrepresented by those who do.

    For the records, God loves everyone -whether they believe in Him or not. And He loves gay people too, although the gay lifestyle is what He doesn’t approve of – according to Biblical guidelines which clearly show that heterogeneous relationship is God’s perfect plan for mankind.

    God gave us a special gift called freewill. Unfortunately some us are using it against Him. But we can never outsmart Him. In any case, we make our choices and our choices make us.


    1. So, he loves us so much he invented Hell to reinforce that fact? Sheol wasn’t good enough, so he had to up the ante? Misunderstanding is not the sole province of unbelievers. Believers seem to believe what they want to believe and disregard the rest.

      Liked by 3 people

      1. God loves us so much He has made a way for us to have an eternal relationship with Him through His Son Jesus Christ. Hell wasn’t originally meant for human beings. It was meant for the devil and his demons. Unfortunately, any one who rejects God has sided with the devil. As a result such people will end up where the devil himself will end up.

        Believers in God don’t believe what they want to believe as you said. What they believe about God is what God’s book, the Bible, says about Him. It is another thing if one doesn’t accept the authority of the Bible.


    2. If you’re going to preach on an atheist’s blog you need to bring something more honest to the table than the run-of-the-mill freewill argument.

      People rape, murder, abuse, rob and torture because YHWH has given them free will? So, his sovereignty allows their heinous crimes to happen? That sounds like a sadist to me. He honors the “free will” of a horrible human being over the “free will” of his or her victim? God doesn’t allow the victim of the crime to move in his or her free will. If he did, said person wouldn’t be a victim. Instead, there would be very little rape, murder, abuse, and other violent crimes, if any at all. God has the ability to stop pain and suffering and willingly chooses not to do so. Well, the Bible does mention that YHWH created evil.

      As far as eternity is concerned, there’s absolutely no free will in Evangelical Christianity. Heaven is all about being oppressed by YHWH. It is a non stop worship session for the biggest narcissist of all time. That isn’t the love that you mentioned, it’s an abusive, and codependent relationship forever. Hell is a different type of torture involving pain for an eternity and being at the devil’s command. Heaven, hell, they really don’t sound that different to me.

      And Jesus is no better than YHWH. His preaching and commands are even more ridiculous than the old laws. For according to his teachings, even thinking about someone in a sexual way outside of marriage is adultery. He supposedly said that just being angry with someone makes that person no better than a murderer. Jesus is the ring leader of guilt and manipulation. That is not love, that is disdain for all of mankind.

      Liked by 3 people

        1. That was never implied in my comment. But I did say that everyone would be held accountable for whatever he or she did with their freewill.

          Of course, it will not fly in court. The rapist will be judged according to the law.

          In the same way, God will eventually judge everyone who rejects Him based on their freewill.


      1. I am not preaching, as it were. Just airing my views just as you are doing here…

        It seems you know a bit about the events recorded in the Bible. But it appears you have everything mixed up. We could straighten up things for you here and there.

        Like I said before, so many people who don’t know God have him completely misunderstood. You obviously fall into that category.

        Yes God is responsible for giving humans the freewill, but He is not responsible for what we do with it. It is that same free will you are exercising here by painting God and Jesus in bad light. That’s your call. But we know God better that.

        We would be mere robots if God took away our freewill. That’s why it is important He left it with us. He gave us the CHOICE…

        Consider this my final response to you on this post. If you want to continue the conversation with me, I will be glad to have you on my blog. I have a couple of posts you might find interesting, or ridiculous depending on your mindset.


        1. The fact that you are a Christian on an atheist’s blog writing to the author/s and their readers about YHWH, heaven, hell and Jesus is “preaching” in and of itself.

          And no, there is no reason for me to go to your blog. I’m a grown woman who began my 20 year deconversion process while earning my theology degree as a young adult at a Pentecostal Bible School. That process finally ended five and a half years ago. I have no desire to follow your Jesus. I subjected my self to that misery for far too long. You have nothing new to show me.

          Free will is an absolute illusion. No one chooses the parents they’re born to. No one has a choice in their genitalia at birth. No one can control their nationality and what race they are. No one has a say as to where they can be born. And often, people are indoctrinated into their faith through family, culture and even government.

          If anything, “free will” encourages victim blaming and shaming. It gives license to judging others for circumstances that were/are beyond their control. After all, the notion is they must have done something horrible to have been bullied, imprisoned, raped, foreclosed or bankrupt.

          Liked by 1 person

          1. Free Will, I think, in fact, you do not understand what it means. A person’s “will” whether free or predestined is a faculty of decision not of being, which of course you’re confusing in your examples of parents, sex, nationality etc.

            Of course, naturally, there’s even the argument in philosophy that since you, in fact, understand with a priori knowledge the concept of free will–or do you?–then it does exist because this isn’t something you’ve come to dismiss until having come to a posteriori knowledge of the faculty of the existence of persons. Of course, I remember reading one philosopher who wrote a critique of those who argue against free will that it would thus be foolish to build prisons for no one would never be responsible for their actions. I would suspect if you have a Theology degree you would know the philosopher, but maybe not from Pentecostal School.

            Regardless, I would further assert that if there be no free will and no necessary being who has predestined a will then the only state of being would be nature–Chaos. And if there is only Chaos within the state of nature, even if morality was a development of evolutionary survival, once humanity has reasoned this conclusion, it would be foolish to carry on any sort of moral code at the expense of the individual person. And some would agree with this assertion.


      2. I agree with you that the “Free Will” argument is more complicated and perhaps faulty than it seems to those of Victors persuasion. But, the last segment on Jesus is grossly false. I could argue that within Christian theology- conservative atleast- God made man so that all duties to be given to him were for his good and not merely to torment the hell out of him, but, perhaps that wont fly. The following is simply speculation, and I could very well be wrong: All actions flow from the heart- from desire. Discipline is great, but simply a haulting or staling of that desire. What kind of Dad would put a desire in his child’s heart to simply have it turned down- perhaps, to account for more components- what kind of Dad would give his child a great, and powerful desire- namely sex- and tell him. “No, not today.” as the child wails and laments in a desire not satisfied. It is better for the childs nature to put that desire away in a sense for the moment, than to have a strong desire not appeased.

        With Murder- being angry with someone doesn’t necessarily equate to murder. A Man could rightly hate a man’s actions, but wrongly hate the man himself. This is because Man is made in God’s image, and if one hates another they hate what is, in essence, divine. Or, in other words, hate what is objectively good, or worthy. But, again, perhaps I’m off to some extent.


            1. I’m sorry, I wasn’t clear, when I said that the last segment was false, I didn’t mean that what Jesus said was false, but that your remark on the commands absurdity was false. I was alittle confused as to why you responded that way, but now I see.


  6. Heading off to class was far from easy. I was constantly afraid of getting mugged, or even worse, killed.

    As a graduate student at Yale, I lived off-campus in an apartment that was at the edge of a slum community. Yet I never had any fear of being mugged or killed.

    I am sorry to inform you, but none of this account is true.

    I’m glad to hear that. Your description did not ring true to me.

    Well, okay, I did eat at the Dining hall, and sometimes the food might be describable as slop (but nutritious slop). But, overall, that secular university was a great place. And it was even a great place for Christians (which I was for my first semester there).

    It’s amazing that some Christians need to make up ridiculous stories about secular universities. And they make up those stories while claiming to be concerned about truth.

    Liked by 1 person

  7. The difference is, your college was secular, as is most of the educational world; It allows anyone to be there, and the selling point is education, not blind obedience to a particular god. No one, frankly, really really cares if you’re Jewish, or Baptist, or atheist.
    This can be very very hard to comprehend for someone so truly steeped in the kind of religious upbriging your fiancee knows. God does NOT drag us through life, he does not monitor every word, bite, or act. He’s a prosthetic walker that keeps people upright. Take that away and I suspect they would collapse in a heap.

    This was a fascinating and very balanced post. thank you.

    (Afterthought: I suspect the students in your fiancee’s class are there because they already believe most of what he’s selling, and none of them is particularly surprised. He is merely reaffirming what they already know, with his own particular spin on it. Sadly. )

    Liked by 1 person

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